Insomnia ([info]insomnia) wrote,
@ 2005-08-06 14:50:00
Previous Entry  Add to memories!  Tell a Friend  Next Entry
Sniper wars in Iraq.
The Guardian has a very interesting story about an Iraqi sniper known only as Juba, who, since February has reportedly killed at least two U.S. soldiers in southern Iraq, while wounding at six others. Some believe that he has shot up to a dozen other soldiers.

He's patient, an expert shot, and he only fires once, never giving his prey a target to fix upon. Teams of U.S. snipers are now reportedly hunting for the man, who is a threat not only in terms of lives lost, but also because his methods could appeal to those Iraqis who would resist the U.S. but are turned off by the often indiscriminate attacks by terrorists and the insurgency.


(133 comments) - (Post a new comment)


[info]john_of_arabia
2005-08-07 12:20 am UTC (link)
When you pass things like this on, it sounds like you're gloating over US deaths as a "see, I told you so." I think you can lay off that. I respect your opposition to the war, but articles like this, whether they're true or not, shouldn't be used to support your position. What is your point to providing link to this?

We die. We are soldiers. The enemy is in many cases competent ex-soldiers of the Iraqi regime. We do have respect for their fighting abilties. However, spreading stories of the insurgents successes is aiding and abbetting the enemy in a time of war. I think you probably have a fair idea of what that means, and what that's considered.

(Reply to this) (Thread)


[info]luthien_amandil
2005-08-07 12:55 am UTC (link)
That's highly subjective. I think this post is an example of respect for the techniques The Other Side (as you seem sort of keen in this comment to leave them as a vague force which should remain outside our knowledge) are using. Look, my nearest and dearest is a sniper in Iraq, so it scares me shitless to read things like this, but isn't it always good to know what you're up against? I'm thankful when insomnia posts things like this: lets me know the things that my other half doesn't always tell me, as he's trying to protect me from what he really goes through. This shouldn't be a propanganda war, with every media agency trying to convince civilians the enemy are untrained baboons, and it's only a matter of time before they're taken out. You can despise what someone is doing, and still respect that they're capable of doing it.

But like I said, subjective.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)(Expand)

(no subject) - [info]john_of_arabia, 2005-08-07 01:49 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]jk_fabiani, 2005-08-07 02:10 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]john_of_arabia, 2005-08-07 02:16 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]jk_fabiani, 2005-08-07 02:19 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]paladyn, 2005-08-07 03:54 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]jacian, 2005-08-07 04:16 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]lafinjack, 2005-08-07 04:29 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]john_of_arabia, 2005-08-07 04:41 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]lafinjack, 2005-08-07 04:50 pm UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]luthien_amandil, 2005-08-07 07:21 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]rothgar, 2005-08-07 02:00 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]jk_fabiani, 2005-08-07 02:16 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]john_of_arabia, 2005-08-07 02:20 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]jk_fabiani, 2005-08-07 02:24 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]loquacis, 2005-08-07 02:43 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]jk_fabiani, 2005-08-07 02:58 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]rothgar, 2005-08-07 08:04 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]luthien_amandil, 2005-08-07 07:25 am UTC (Expand)

[info]guttaperk
2005-08-07 02:55 am UTC (link)
What do you offer as an alternative to "spreading stories"?

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)(Expand)

(no subject) - [info]john_of_arabia, 2005-08-07 03:36 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]guttaperk, 2005-08-07 03:42 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]paladyn, 2005-08-07 03:52 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]guttaperk, 2005-08-07 03:56 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]blacksnail, 2005-08-07 04:49 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]guttaperk, 2005-08-07 10:24 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]naruvonwilkins, 2005-08-07 03:44 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]insomnia, 2005-08-07 07:24 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]rothgar, 2005-08-07 08:23 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]babity, 2005-08-12 06:25 pm UTC (Expand)
say what? - [info]pierceheart, 2005-08-08 01:39 pm UTC (Expand)

[info]naruvonwilkins
2005-08-07 03:43 am UTC (link)
Yes, that's right - freedom of the press aids the enemy!

Ignorance is strength, comrade.

(Reply to this) (Parent)


[info]insomnia
2005-08-07 06:54 am UTC (link)
When I link to news about a particularly intense kind of warfare in Iraq that is generally unseen by the civilians, I'm gloating over U.S. deaths? No.

Rather, I find sniper vs. sniper combat very interesting. Lots of people do, in the same way that they find ninjas or samurai interesting. Highly skilled warriors fighting a very personal battle against other highly skilled warriors is the meat and bones of gripping war stories, and frankly, it's a bit of a change to see an Iraqi insurgent who is skilled at such a level.

I'm not aiding and abbetting the enemy. Certainly, I'm not sending him care packages. I'm using my own personal journal to draw attention to a story I found interesting. If you don't find it interesting, don't read it.

(Reply to this) (Parent)


[info]walkingshark
2005-08-07 07:15 am UTC (link)
I'm sorry but I have to strongly disagree with you. This is a valid news story about the evolution of the ground war. I didn't see him gloating or saying this was a good thing in any way, and taken in context with his other posts it seems to indicate more that he is very disturbed by what is going on.

I will come out and directly say that you are reading things into the post that simply were not there. I will also say that your equation of posting this story to treason sickens me, and is the kind of juvenile immature playground thinking that is hurting this country.

I respect the fact that you are willing to sacrifice your life for your country. Please be aware, however, that your sacrifice is cheapened when any dissent, or even pointing out how things might be going wrong in the war, is labeled as treason.

The only true treason in this war belongs to the Bushies, since they conspired to lie to begin the war, directly harming the national security of the United States for no gain at all, and also displaying a level of incompetence that will be remarked on for a hunred generations.

(Reply to this) (Parent)


[info]snarkactual
2005-08-07 09:11 am UTC (link)
Dude, I disagree with Insomnia's "all is lost" philosophy and his general whininess and unwillingness to work constructively while at the same time exposing his ignorance of the history and politics of the region in general and Iraq in particular. Yes, some of the insurgents are pretty good and we've had some sniper on sniper incidents that make good stories. Ultimately, the sniper in the article he quoted will be hunted down. This is not to say that it will not be a difficult task especially to those who will do the job. Counter sniper tactics are not something we talk about other than to say that eventually we'll get them and that's just a fact of life. The sniper may do more damage for an individual than the average insurgent, but even with his efforts we'll eliminate him and the others as we slowly take the support for them away. So, let him post his little "news" in ignorance that one of the many reasons that he doesn't hear about these is that the sniper is probably already dead and that we don't talk about our tactics and whether the enemy was picked up because of intelligence provided by locals, or shot by one of several counter sniper teams, maybe by a regular rifle squad on patrol or maybe by a sniper in a Blackhawk or Little Bird in overwatch.

(Reply to this) (Parent)

I could not disagree with you more
[info]j5nn5r
2005-08-07 04:32 pm UTC (link)
Reporting on what is happening, as long as the report does not contain operational information (troop strength, locations, specific tactics, new equipment, etc) is not aiding the enemy. Calling someone a traitor in the attempt to shut them up, because the news isn't liked is a pretty cheap tactic.

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that a bullet from an AK will kill easily with a head shot. The bad guys in Iraq know this already. It's just that few of them have the equipment or the skills to take out an American soldier with a head shot from more than a couple hundred yards. While some of the Rafidan I met were indeed idiots, others were very smart. Some were former Republican Guard. This article isn't teaching anyone anything new.

The stories of this war, what our soldiers have to fight, and how, are crucial for the American people. The more disconnected the American people are from the realities of war, the more likely they are to stand by and let you be sent into harms way for poor reasons. The American people need to understand what it is like to be a soldier, what we have to go through, before they unthinkingly tie a bunch of yellow ribbons on a freeway overpass or stick a magnetic ribbon to their car on their way to their safe job, in their safe country, and watch politicians declare victory on the safe TV.

One more thing...

"We die. We are soldiers," does sound heroic, almost romantic. I met this attitude in some of my comrades when they said things like, "when it's your time, it's your time," as they shrugged and did what I consider stupid, stupid things on patrol. The man who said this to me most died in November.

I prefer.

"We previal. We are warriors," myself.


(Reply to this) (Parent)


[info]pierceheart
2005-08-08 01:42 pm UTC (link)
"in a time of war"

if you are going to throw around an extremely legalistic phrase "aiding and abetting," then let me point out: legally, it ain't a war.
War has not been declared.

(Reply to this) (Parent)


[info]shortindiangirl
2005-08-09 12:37 am UTC (link)
Regulating the types of stories one tells has its own challenges. I can understand the security issues, but regulating "news" under that vizor ends up raising equally hoary questions.

(Reply to this) (Parent)

I wanted to share my thoughts...will you consider?
[info]idiannalynne
2006-02-12 08:00 pm UTC (link)
Hi, I wanted to read more about this sniper story that I only caught a brief news report on the other day.... I can't help but have thoughts run through my head immediately after hearing the press "state facts" (ha that is too funny...not laughable though). First, please consider this. This is just my personal thinking and I don't know who to tell it to, so in reading some of your posts, I think you might be a wise one to share this with. I think our soldiers need to consider the sniper(s) as a possible female...and I think we need to consider him/her as a possibility of being one of our own. I know that brings chills...but so did Timothy McVay when he used everything he learned in the service against innocent people and even babies. Has anyone even delved into these thinkings? Am I the only one who gets these crazier than real life thoughts at times? Am I the only one who can see things in multiple ways? There was a murder here in Texas that I knew immediately from looking at a picture they showed on the news that it was the spouse who killed. It took months before the spouse was arrested...and the spouse was indeed guilty. Maybe I am a bit paranoid, but trusting is too valuable of a thing for us to do in certain situations. We cannot afford to trust...that means we cannot afford to trust our government will take care of us, we cannot afford our doctors want to "cure" us, we cannot afford to trust there will be a social security plan when it is our turn to collect (after years and years of contributing), we cannot trust that we will be notified or protected from dangerous situations (Katrina). I could go on, but it is depressing. And I am trying to banish that from my short life here on this globe.
Also, I must mention this other thing...seldom do we see the news cover any stories at all of battle victims who return home. We really NEED TO ASK THEM, did they or do they support the cause. We only hear about the loved ones left behind by deceased sons or daughters, husbands, wives, cry about how unfair it was and how this fighting isn't necessary. By now, we Americans should wisen up to see that we cannot retreat now. It isn't an option and if the next president decides to do that, we will have smeared blood on our country that will be so disrespected and minimized by other countries. We are not bullying the less than developed country into our way of thinking...we are showing them civilization includes having fresh clean water and decent food for everyone. Not just the gold brick holders. We are also showing them that each one of us is God created and deserves the RIGHT to live without fear of being tortured for unsupported accusations. Am I on a soap box? I don't know. When I speak deep, my hands are used by God Almighty. That's everyone's God, in whatever form he/she/it is worshipped. The energy of God is greater than anything. That should be feared. Fighting is man decided and sometimes has to be done. I think we Americans need to shut up about how "wrong" it is for us to be over there and say, "We are there, we support you folks for your dangerous position." No more Vietnam, please. I didn't live in it but I am a victim of my father who did. We have come a long way since then and we need to support and love. In the end, there are no coincidences. Everything happens for a God given reason.

Please write to me at idi_idi@yahoo.com but only if you are going to be kind. I don't need crap from those of you who need a cranioanalectomy.
love to all.
di

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)(Expand)

Re: I wanted to share my thoughts...will you consider? - [info]john_of_arabia, 2006-02-13 01:18 pm UTC (Expand)

[info]naruvonwilkins
2005-08-07 03:45 am UTC (link)
I've heard about this guy. Just one more reason to bring my friends home from that place.

(Reply to this) (Thread)


[info]john_of_arabia
2005-08-07 04:15 am UTC (link)
No, we should kill him and keep fighting until we win.

As always, there is a balance between sides of a story. This story, as I pointed out in another reply, can be hurtful, and help our enemy.

I also find his postings to be dwelling on the negative. There are many sides to be spoken about.

I also find it interesting that not a single person who has commented here, that has defended the news story, has ever had the dirt of Iraq under his boots. Maybe firsthand experience has given us a different view of what reality is.

It's kinda like sex. You can talk about it all you want, but until you experience it, you really have no idea what you're talking about.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)(Expand)

(no subject) - [info]jacian, 2005-08-07 04:24 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]john_of_arabia, 2005-08-07 04:30 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]jacian, 2005-08-07 04:36 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]jacian, 2005-08-07 04:48 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]john_of_arabia, 2005-08-07 04:55 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]naruvonwilkins, 2005-08-07 05:12 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]insomnia, 2005-08-07 06:58 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]walkingshark, 2005-08-07 07:27 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]blacksnail, 2005-08-07 07:30 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]snarkactual, 2005-08-07 07:43 pm UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]walkingshark, 2005-08-08 05:25 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]snarkactual, 2005-08-08 07:32 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]walkingshark, 2005-08-08 03:11 pm UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]snarkactual, 2005-08-08 03:55 pm UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]shortindiangirl, 2005-08-09 12:40 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]john_of_arabia, 2005-08-09 02:06 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]naruvonwilkins, 2005-08-07 05:11 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]john_of_arabia, 2005-08-07 05:19 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]naruvonwilkins, 2005-08-07 05:24 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]blacksnail, 2005-08-07 05:29 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]naruvonwilkins, 2005-08-07 05:35 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]blacksnail, 2005-08-07 05:53 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]naruvonwilkins, 2005-08-07 05:54 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]blacksnail, 2005-08-07 05:59 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]naruvonwilkins, 2005-08-07 06:03 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]blacksnail, 2005-08-07 07:03 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]insomnia, 2005-08-07 07:41 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]dekarch, 2005-08-07 10:58 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]insomnia, 2005-08-07 02:12 pm UTC (Expand)
Lancet Figures - [info]dekarch, 2005-08-09 06:49 am UTC (Expand)
Re: Lancet Figures - [info]insomnia, 2005-08-10 11:37 am UTC (Expand)
Re: Lancet Figures - [info]dekarch, 2005-08-10 06:20 pm UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]naruvonwilkins, 2005-08-07 03:39 pm UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]dekarch, 2005-08-07 04:33 pm UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]naruvonwilkins, 2005-08-07 04:38 pm UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]dekarch, 2005-08-07 04:42 pm UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]naruvonwilkins, 2005-08-07 04:48 pm UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]insomnia, 2005-08-07 06:35 pm UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]naruvonwilkins, 2005-08-08 02:25 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]insomnia, 2005-08-07 06:04 pm UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]dekarch, 2005-08-09 07:42 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]js7a, 2005-08-11 06:40 pm UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]naruvonwilkins, 2005-08-07 03:07 pm UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]john_of_arabia, 2005-08-07 08:08 pm UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]pierceheart, 2005-08-08 01:53 pm UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]soldiergrrrl, 2005-08-07 07:12 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]naruvonwilkins, 2005-08-07 03:03 pm UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]soldiergrrrl, 2005-08-07 03:16 pm UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]naruvonwilkins, 2005-08-07 03:36 pm UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]snarkactual, 2005-08-07 06:51 pm UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]soldiergrrrl, 2005-08-08 09:53 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]js7a, 2005-08-10 09:37 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]soldiergrrrl, 2005-08-10 11:44 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]js7a, 2005-08-10 01:13 pm UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]soldiergrrrl, 2005-08-10 05:26 pm UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]js7a, 2005-08-11 05:26 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]soldiergrrrl, 2005-08-11 12:35 pm UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]js7a, 2005-08-11 04:46 pm UTC (Expand)
Sharon Jumper quotations continued - [info]js7a, 2005-08-11 04:50 pm UTC (Expand)

(Deleted post)
(no subject) - [info]naruvonwilkins, 2005-08-12 06:50 pm UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]babity, 2005-08-12 07:42 pm UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]naruvonwilkins, 2005-08-12 08:35 pm UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]j5nn5r, 2005-08-07 04:34 pm UTC (Expand)
i shy away from harsh criticism - [info]swingland, 2005-08-08 01:48 pm UTC (Expand)

[info]john_of_arabia
2005-08-07 04:38 am UTC (link)
TO everyone who has commented on this article:

When I came to work tonight, the first thing I had to deal with was a few more dead and a lot more wounded. The next thing I saw was this post.

Perhaps I overreacted. I guy I know here was shot and killed by a sniper a few weeks ago. It doesn't sit well with me when I see tactics such as this spread around, for it may mean that another friend or myself may fall victim to it.

I am all for freedom of the press. I am all for questioning this war.

I am also an American soldier, fighting in Iraq, and I want to win. If it means not glorifying insurgent successes, then so be it. Perhaps we have forgotten what it means, and what it takes, to win.

(Reply to this) (Thread)


[info]guttaperk
2005-08-07 10:37 am UTC (link)
If you allow yourself and your leaders to betray your basic freedoms- even "just a little"- then you are *losing*, no matter who dies or lives in combat.

(Reply to this) (Parent)


[info]supedujour
2005-08-07 12:48 pm UTC (link)
You didn't overreact. You made a reasonable statement. Just as the poster had every right to post what he did, you have every right to react with the reasonable comment that you left. You have an understanding that the original poster does not. Carry on Soldier. Your fight in print is as important as your fight in reality. We all have your back.

(Reply to this) (Parent)


[info]snarkactual
2005-08-07 09:20 pm UTC (link)
IMHO, you were over-reacting. OTOH, you had a lot of mitigating circumstances and every now and then stuff just rubs you the wrong way because of the stress.

So, maybe you unloaded. But better to unload in words than in some more destructive fashion.

Keep it chilly bro' even in all that heat.

(Reply to this) (Parent)


[info]dekarch
2005-08-07 05:11 am UTC (link)
Several things just don't sound right in this article. From the phrasing of the alleged quote from the Colonel, to the ranks of the soldiers involved, to where certain units are alleged to be. Marine Corps scout snipers work in 2 man teams, not four. Snipers always work dismounted so the quote from the alleged US Army sniper (actually he'd be a spotter, since the snipers are the senior men and usually NCOs) doesn't sound right either.

This, plus the fact that it was run in the Guardian, makes it sound highly suspicious. I don't buy it. I know you do because it buys into your preconcieved notions, that anything which helps the enemy is a positive good for those of your political persuasion. But I'm going to throw the bullshit card on this story.

(Reply to this) (Thread)


[info]jacian
2005-08-07 06:06 am UTC (link)
I don't even know what the hell the guardian is? A tabloid in britain?

The only point I made was... I don't care if someone posts something they read on their livejournal. It's their right and by all means, go for it.

As for the content of the article, yeah... most of it doesn't add up. But there are snipers on the opposing side. You know that. I know that. We all know that.

I lost my point and don't wish to try articulating. Maybe I didn't have a point.

Tired, very tired.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)(Expand)

(no subject) - [info]dekarch, 2005-08-07 06:46 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]jacian, 2005-08-07 06:56 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]insomnia, 2005-08-07 07:17 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]soldiergrrrl, 2005-08-07 10:13 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]js7a, 2005-08-11 07:02 pm UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]dekarch, 2005-08-07 10:40 am UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]insomnia, 2005-08-07 02:27 pm UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]insomnia, 2005-08-07 02:30 pm UTC (Expand)
(no subject) - [info]insomnia, 2005-08-07 07:25 am UTC (Expand)

[info]adoka
2005-08-07 05:11 am UTC (link)
It seems to me that Insomnia only posted this to the community. He didn't write the article for the Guardian. How likely is it that a sniper in Iraq is going to read the article in a British newspaper and take heart from that or even use it to spread that as a tactic to other insurgents.

Purely on a numbers thing I would think the casualty rate would drop if the insurgents switched from IED to individual snipers. Then one could send snipers to hunt snipers and a little headway could be made there.

I am not an Iraqi, never been to Iraq, and have no desire to go to Iraq but I gotta wonder, if this country were invaded what citizens here would do. The Iraqi's didn't invade this country, blow up the WTC, nor were they in danger of building nuclear weapons. This president chose to send troops there to smash and grab like some corner gangster doing a home invasion. I feel bad that men and women who enlisted to protect and defend the constitution, hearth and home, or earn a bundle of cash for college got sucked into this private little war by the current administration. However I am not going to blame folks for trying to kick some ass of an invading horde or the people who they perceive as collaborators. It is quite simply a dirty rotten mess all the way around in which good and bad people are getting the shaft by people who will never have to pay the bill for this crap.

(Reply to this) (Thread)


[info]jacian
2005-08-07 06:16 am UTC (link)
If America was invaded by another country... the American population would fight back like a bunch of rabid motherfuckers. And We'd fight dirty too... we wouldn't care if we killed your friend, your brother, your father... just as long as we could keep and gain back what was our's. That's human nature. However... there are people in this country (Iraq) who will kill you for being American, or just looking like a westerner. Because they believe in their cause. So it's a no win argument here. I understand the Iraqi civilians who just want their country back and to go on with their lives. But the people who support killing others just because they're different, think different, or have whatever... I do not support. I want to make a difference here, and that might sound cliche. But essentially my main worry over here is just do my job, do it well, and get everyone back home safe.

(Reply to this) (Parent)


[info]insomnia
2005-08-07 07:29 am UTC (link)
To be precise, I posted it only to my own personal journal. Not to a community, nor did I write the article. This article sticks out because it's unlike others out there, in that it tells of a more complex conflict than we normally hear about. It disturbs me that I have people essentially saying "why don't you censor what you post?" as if I were a major news source.

The article is not intended as propaganda -- it's a report on an actual sniper and the actual problems he's causing in Iraq, and some of the things that are being done to combat him and others like him. It's news, and newsworthy, and, judging from all the comments, apparently of interest to people.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)(Expand)

(no subject) - [info]snarkactual, 2005-08-07 07:16 pm UTC (Expand)

[info]snarkactual
2005-08-07 09:53 am UTC (link)
Very interesting indeed, the story of a man who has marked himself to be hunted down like an animal. Whose demise will probably not be written of because we don't talk about counter sniper operations other than to say they happen. At the point that the Brit news service became aware of his story, (IOW it was common knowledge in the AO) he was doomed. The only unanswered question will be was he caught in a sweep initiated by intelligence provided by some joe in the neighborhood, taken out by a squad on patrol or did he buy a bullet from an M21, M24, M82A1, M107 or something else.
The DoD on its website www.defenselink.mil has mentioned on more than one occasion that we have had sniper and counter sniper operations in various areas in Iraq including IIRC the battle of Fallujah among others. They tend to end the same way. The "Juba" of that story maybe one or it may be an aggregation of the stories of a dozen snipers. The "Tabuk" (which in the story is "Tobuk") is a longer barreled version of the Yugoslav M70B1 in 7.62X39 (standard AK-47 round) it has a limited range owing to the short cartridge and heavy bullet which pretty much will mean that shots are limited to not much over 200 meters. The versions I've seen don't have optical sights, merely iron sights and most have not been found with the special ammo that the SVD had. According to open source intelligence it is more of a "designated marksman" rifle versus a true sniper's rifle. Which means that it isn't even in the class of our current "designated marksman" rifle the M21 which has better optics (scope or imaging device) and longer range than the "Tabuk" and is definitely outclassed by the issue sniper rifle the M24 or M107 which have much better optics and longer range than the M21 (the M107 can hit a target at over a half mile).

(Reply to this) (Thread)


[info]naruvonwilkins
2005-08-07 04:42 pm UTC (link)
What, is he already dead?

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)(Expand)

(no subject) - [info]snarkactual, 2005-08-07 07:31 pm UTC (Expand)
Confused and Wannabe American
(Anonymous)
2005-08-07 05:03 pm UTC (link)
I have been reading the post and all the comments. I am really
confused. Here goes.

To become an American are you required to express only the Administration point of view ?

If Arab fighters in Arab land is foreign fighters who are the L.A gangs ?

What amendment of the constituion provides inalienable rights to occupy a
foreign nation for Oil exploration ?

Is Arab civilians killed are always counted as 'collateral casualties' or
is there a macro available for Microsoft Excel which gives an accurate result?

Can an Iraqi christian insurgent be absolved of his sins and be Born Again ?

Is there any truth to Disney planning to acquire Abu Gharib property for
future Arab theme park ?

What is a Patriot ? Is it a missile which misses SCUDs are the true
believers who signed up in the One Man Army for better education ?

To become a citizen can I watch any TV shows other than Fox and 700 club ?

Can a soldier of Christian Science faith allowed to become a 'medic' ?

To the soldiers out there be safe and come home soon.


(Reply to this) (Thread)

Re: Confused and Wannabe American
(Anonymous)
2005-09-13 02:05 pm UTC (link)
Guys, you need to come back to the US alive. The reasons for you being there are simple lies.

$5.5 billion per month and the waist of lives of US citizens is real Treason.

(Reply to this) (Parent)

Juba alive and kicking asses
[info]salaam1420
2006-01-02 11:22 pm UTC (link)
So it sounds like Juba is still alive and kicking.

The net is plenty of videos of his job on southern Baghdad.

I was looking for pictores of Tabuks for a drawing of this sniper for a magazine and just found this old thread. I just knew about the existence of Juba this past week and now I realize he is working around Baghdad for a lot of months.

The numbers of casualties must to be really large. In the videos I downloaded there are dozens and dozens of invaders being shot by snipers.

Well people, see ya!

(Reply to this) (Thread)

Re: Juba alive and kicking asses
[info]insomnia
2006-01-26 08:29 am UTC (link)
Juba is quite possibly a composite, which is to say that he gets credited for many sniper attacks which he didn't do. For all we know, the original Joba may have never existed, or may have gotten unlucky by now.

(Reply to this) (Parent)


(133 comments) - (Post a new comment)

Create an Account
Forgot your login or password?
Login w/ OpenID
English • Español • Deutsch • Русский…